Milhouse

Microsoft Surface

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RobM    195

I had one of the 20 RT's I was talking about in the previous thread, but it lasted just a few hours before being put back in its box. I even upgraded to 8.1 to see if that made it useful, but it didn't. I just don't see the point.

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MadDog    464

The wife uses hers as a web browser, just as she did with the Playbook and I think she's getting onto it for that

 

I'm still struggling to work out how to use it correctly - but to be honest I've not given it much time yet

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RobM    195

I think a big part of my problem with it was the other kit I use - at work I have an HP Spectre XT Pro (Ultrabook), at home I have a 13" MBA and an iPad Mini. The Surface was almost as big as my laptops and nowhere near as portable as the iPad Mini, so didn't offer any benefit.

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satsuma    178

Well it seems the Surface 2 event is scheduled for 23rd Sept in NYC.

New RT version expected to be Tegra4, 1080p display and 4GB RAM.

The Pro version will be Haswell-powered have a a keyboard cover with extra battery inside as an option (think Nokia worked on this) and also a new dock allowing USB 3.0 connectivity and external display connectivity.

Both new models will have a slightly redesigned "2-stage" kick stand - dunno what means but if helps to balance better on one's lap then it's a good thing.

If Microsoft want this to take off they really need to get the pricing right.

Subsidising the RT hardware, in particular, is surely the only way MSFT are going to get any traction for RT with consumers.

Seeing as MSFT is always braying that it will become a services and devices company then they might as well subsidise the Pro too and say 'to he'll with licencees' not liking it.

MSFT's licencee business model is slowly dying anyway.

If they're going to make money from services and devices then they'd better put their only where their mouth is.

The Pro needs to come in (with cover) at significantly less than similarly specced touch ultrabook otherwise I just cannot see people adopting it.

And the RT at significantly less than equivalent iPad.

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mcgrad    74

Why would you spend $900M on the original RT writedown, to only to potentially make the same mistake again.

I'm sure it wasn't the specs holding the RT back, so wont it simply be same problem different hardware?

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Stuclark    70

I've recently been given an rt surface and have to say is actually quite nice. The gf prefers it to the ipad I also have even though she's got an iphone too.

The biggest advantage is surface is the proper usb port on the thing, the worst disadvantage is the price; they need to cost roughly half what they currently do to get traction in the market place

Sent from my GT-I9100 using Tapatalk 4

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satsuma    178

And that's exactly the point Stu.

I think the Surface RT is a great piece of kit.

I think Surface could really hurt iPad if they priced at say $100-$150 below iPad.

I know they would make a loss but then MSFT need to find some services and add-ons they can sell to make up the loss.

In any case if they don't subsidise RT is dead in the water.

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RobM    195

If Microsoft can only sell RT's in decent numbers by making a loss on it, it doesn't inspire confidence in it's long-term viability. Apple, Samsung etc have proven that the right product at the right price will sell in good numbers. Microsoft and BlackBerry have proven that dropping the price through the floor on the wrong product won't ever be a success.

 

How many companies can afford to continue such a strategy long-term?

 

The RT isn't a bad product, neither was the Playbook in fact, it's just a product that answers a question nobody was asking, while also lacking the oh-so-important developer and community support.

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Milhouse    355

The problem is that once you start out by undercutting Apple in order to win sales and chase market share, how on Earth do you then raise prices in future? The norm (as practised by Apple) is for newer, better products to match the price of the old.

Google on the other hand aren't interested in making a profit on hardware - it's all about the services - so are quite happy to sell hardware at near cost, leaving the profit taking to Samsung.

I suspect Microsofts concern is that if they start out low balling on price, the die will be cast and they'll never make serious money from hardware sales as nobody will view Windows RT or Pro as premium products.

Microsoft do clearly view their products as high-end items (even if nobody else does) and must feel they'll be condemning themselves if they cut the price to compete with Apple, but if they don't they'll be writing off the hardware cost for a second time in 12 months.

Microsoft, which is transforming itself into a devices and services company, is trying desperately to emulate Apple (in particular their margins on hardware) but will probably end up emulating Google instead.

Edited by Milhouse
Edit: Adding some line breaks - I swear this had formatting when I posted it from Tapatalk...

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Simmotino    33

There is an almost relentless advertising campaign going on over here in the US at the moment for the Surface and the perceived benefits over the iPad.

 

The ad was quite funny the first couple of times but, having seen it the best part of 30 or 40 times this week, it's just plain annoying now!

 

YouTube vid

Edited by Simmotino

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Milhouse    355

Just out of interest, what's the Windows Phone advertising like?

In the US, Windows Phone has only gained 300,000 net users over the last 6 months (Feb to July).

Posted Image

Posted Image

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Simmotino    33

Just to update this for accuracy, there is an ad running for the Nokia 1020, but it's all about the camera rather than it being a Windows phone, hence it not registering initially.

 

It's also a bloody annoying advert!

 

YouTube video

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Milhouse    355

I've always found it odd how Nokia advertising so carefully avoids mentioning the OS running on their Lumia devices - maybe they knew that would be the kiss of death.

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RobM    195

It always came across to me as Nokia trying to be independent, rather than being ashamed of the OS. They have been honest in saying they avoided Android so they weren't yet another Android manufacturer and I think they're trying to do the same with WP.

 

 

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normal    345

Problem is, that you'd get more cash elsewhere. If they were really trying, they'd bump it up by at least another $100.

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Stuclark    70

I hope that when MS launch Surface 2 and 2 Pro, they'll *significantly* drop the price of the original Surface RT - they really need to get a bit more sales traction before any devs will take the platform seriously (even the likes of Facebook haven't bothered doing a proper client yet).

 

The thing about Surface is the product is actually pretty good, but there's a certain amount of hesitation about a Windows tablet I think, and their advertising hasn't really been selling it's best features as far as I can see.... (those being 1) You can add extra storage and 2) You can plug sugar in - it's got a USB port! )

 

My Surface RT developed a single stuck pixel a couple of weeks ago, and I cheekily thought I'd ask the MS support team if they'd consider looking at it for me... to cut the story short; they took the unit back; took the back cover off it and swapped that (and thus the serial number) on to a brand new unit! When I got it back I had yet-another full day of updates, indicating once again that they have a *LOT* of these things sitting around in a warehouse or 10, that were made last year and haven't been updated since!

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MadDog    464

As a bit of an update - the wife is now using the RT a bit more - now I've set up the mail, contacts and calendar app she is starting to like it a bit more

 

It's defiantly nice to pick up and use as a web browser (which she does a lot) and play youtube videos to keep little-un occupied!

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